What Bible verses that mandate a separation of church and state?
Saturday, October 2nd, 2010 at
2:26 pm
Since the USA was founded on Judaeo-Christian values and tradition, I was wondering that Bible verses the founders looked to in writing the Bill of Rights, and specifically, what book of the Bible includes a template for the Establishment Claus.
KJV only please.
Tagged with: Bible • church • mandate • separation • State • verses
Filed under: Book Writing Template
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Well, I think you know that it’s not in the Bible.
the closest you’ll get is Matthew 22:21, Mark 12:17, and /or Luke 20:25, which all basically say give to the Emporor what is the emporor’s, and give to God what is God’s. But I think that might be a little out of context.
Legally, I think our contemporary view of the separation of Church and state comes from “Lemon v. Kurtzman,” which Wikipedia says was decided in 1968.
Well,
Limiting to King James is a little narrow minded,,,
But,
The founding fathers did NOT set the US up as a Religious Theocracy. They intentionally did NOT want that.
They were very wise, and I can not doubt that the Holy Spirit played a part in the construction of our Government.
But our laws are a reflection of our collective morality.
Good Luck, and God Bless!
Ummmm…. None.
Except possibly for Jesus’ comment to “render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s”.
Other than that, the Old testament presupposed a theocracy, so it wouldn’t come from there. By Jesus’ time, the area was under the rule of Rome so any theocracy had long since passed.
The founders were not Judeo-Christian and there is no bible verse that states the separation of church and state.
The Establishment Clause
Thomas Jefferson’s 1802 letter to a group of Baptists of Danbury, Connecticut states that the purpose of the First Amendment was to build “a wall of separation between church and state.” Yet what President Jefferson meant by this wall is patently obvious from the weight of historical evidence cited above: namely, that this did not mean that there could be no point of contact between church and state. Civil governments have all kinds of laws that churches must obey: building codes, fire safety codes and zoning ordinances. None of these violate the liberty of churches to worship God according to their own liberty of conscience. Furthermore, there are times when the members of ecclesiastical bodies are simply unable to decide issues without submitting to the judgment of civil courts. A prime example of this would be contentions over the ownership of the church’s property.
Thomas Jefferson’s phrase in 1802 must be understood in light of what he said in his “Second Inaugural Address,” in 1805:
“In matters of religion I have considered that its free exercise is placed by the Constitution independent of the powers of the General Government. I have therefore undertaken on no occasion to prescribe the religious exercises suited to it, but have left them, as the Constitution found them, under the direction and discipline of the church or state authorities acknowledged by the several religious societies.”
The USA was found on the premise of a Deity, not on Judeo-Christian valves. The forefathers never wanted the church and state to be mixed. They were alot of Deists who wanted this country free for all religions. Just some of these Deists were Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, the two John Adams, James Madison and many more.
The civil rights of none shall be abridged on account of religious belief or worship, nor shall any national religion be established, nor shall the full and equal rights of conscience be in any manner, or on any pretense, infringed.’ – James Madison (Original wording of the First Amendment; Annals of Congress 434 (June 8, 1789).)
The Bill of rights is not a foundational document, they were the first amendments. Furthermore, just because our country was founded/based on Christian values does not mean that every word and idea was lifted from the bible and then neatly repackaged for the constitution and other documents, but rather that a great deal of it was and that most of the other stuff is still from Christians who believed that what they were implementing was in harmony with Christian ideals. Furthermore, there is no Biblical basis for separation of Church and State as it is currently understood by people. The phrase of “Separation of Church and State” was originally taken from a letter written by Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists and he was explaining that beliefs are between God and a man and that government should not interfere with religion and that Religious groups should not corporately interfere with the role of Government, but rather that faith effects government through faithful individuals in government and other indirect means.
“Since the USA was founded on Judaeo-Christian values and tradition…”
Let’s look at what the Founding Fathers have to say about this popular myth.
“Experience witnesseth that ecclesiastical establishments, instead of maintaining the purity and efficacy of religion, have had a contrary operation. During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution.” – James Madison, “A Memorial and Remonstrance”, 1785
“As I understand the Christian religion, it was, and is, a revelation. But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?” – John Adams, letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816
“In every country and every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot … they have perverted the purest religion ever preached to man into mystery and jargon, unintelligible to all mankind, and therefore the safer engine for their purpose.” – Thomas Jefferson, to Horatio Spafford, March 17, 1814
“Is uniformity attainable? Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.” – Thomas Jefferson, from “Notes on Virginia”
“I wish it (Christianity) were more productive of good works … I mean real good works … not holy-day keeping, sermon-hearing … or making long prayers, filled with flatteries and compliments despised by wise men, and much less capable of pleasing the Deity.” – Benjamin Franklin Works, Vol. VII, p. 75
Now let’s look at what the Bible says about seperation of church and state:
Leviticus and Deuteronomy, in their entirety, are enormous accounts of all of the laws under which the true Kingdom of God is to conduct itself. This includes killing disobediant childre, killing women who are raped but who you don’t hear crying out, killing women who aren’t virgins on your wedding night, killing neighbors who pick up sticks in the yard, and so on.
Isaiah 9:6 makes it very clear that Jesus is supposed to be the government:
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder…
1 Corinthians 12:28 makes it very clear that governments come from God alone:
And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, after that miracles, then gifts of healing, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
If the USA was founded on Christian values as you falsely claim, we would live in an extremely different world. The Bible has no interest in tolerance and multiculturalism: it demands obediance, and God, whose “name is Jealous,” will tolerate nothing else. Thankfully, our Founding Fathers were simply smarter than that and made us a secular nation.
The reason why its seperated does not come from the bible. The founders wanted to make sure that religion was not forced on anyone, by the government. (its going really well huh?!?)
Why KJV? That is the poorest translation, atleast use the NKJV.